Taser comment

[oldmikegraham]

My department mandated taser carry for patrol work a few years ago. I'm not a fan of the mindset I have seen develop with it's use. Taking folks into custody is a contact sport, no amount of technology will change that.

As a weapon system it has it's place. I'm concerned it has become the default weapon in between verbal commands and deadly force.

[wannadiesel]

As an outside observer, it seems to me that the taser has prevented a lot of officer injuries and kept more than a few "non-compliant" individuals from getting shot. The officers I've talked to about tasers love having the option.

[Administrator]

I happen to agree with both of you on this, but I don't see a lot of Taser use with NCSHP. I still carry pepper spray and I agree that sometimes taking someone into custody is a contact sport. There are many times a taser being used when you could have just as easily put someone in an arm bar and effected the arrest. I think for a lot of people, it's the easy way out.

Having said that, I also think it's saved a lot more people from getting hurt both on the LEO side and on the suspect side. Even though the court of public opinion is generally negative when they see someone getting tased, they also don't realize that it could have been a lot more violent without it.

[oldmikegraham]

As an outside observer, it seems to me that the taser has prevented a lot of officer injuries and kept more than a few "non-compliant" individuals from getting shot. The officers I've talked to about tasers love having the option.

The taser has it's place as a weapon system. It is effective and has cut down on injuries for all involved when it works.

My complaint is the mindset and sense of false security it seems to breed as 100% effective.

As an option I like it, just have a backup plan and be prepared for the possibility it may not always be the best answer.

[wannadiesel]

I'll agree with that point. Nothing works 100% of the time, with a taser there will always be times that the probes don't make contact due to clothing or the officer missing the target. Always gotta have a "plan B." :cool:

As an aside, the department I am familiar with had to get new OC spray after they started carrying tasers. The brand they were using had alcohol in it which could be ignited by arcing from the tasers. :eek: Imagine the publicity on that one - "Cop sets man on fire, film at 11." :rolleyes:

[Administrator]

Hence the reason we can carry one or the other but not both. We also have strict policies in place about not using a taser on someone who's been sprayed.

[wannadiesel]

Well, my in my opinion if somebody got set on fire by getting sprayed and then needing to be tased to get compliance then "Serves him right." :D I have no sympathy for somebody that ignorant/stupid/aggressive/cranked up.

But I know that's not the way the TV news folks and the lawyers see it.

[oldmikegraham]

That would be the "screaming alpha" fire practical!

[Administrator]

I do believe that would be a class A fire ;)

[wannadiesel]

Lord knows you wouldn't want to hit him with the wrong extinguisher... :rolleyes:

[Gunsmith/Administrator]

I don't know......You have to admit there is just something inherently funny about a BIG guy flopping around on the ground like a Fish, screaming like a school girl while a Female Officer is telling him to NEVER lay a hand on her again and then zapping him a second and third time to drive her point home :eek:

Some guys are just slow learners I guess hehehe

[Administrator]

ever see the video of the cow being tased? Great stuff.

[XLR8R]

Tasers...

Great example of why I wouldn't make a good LEO.

I'm a pacifist, so when verbal communication breaks down in a potentially violent confrontation, I'd rather move directly to the blasting phase.

[Shovelhead]

Just for giggles:
Bubba bought a 100,000-volt pocket-sized taser as a gift for his wife. Because it uses just 3 AAA batteries, he thought he could give himself a test jolt without suffering too much.
He was mistaken.

The directions said that a one-second burst would shock and disorient your assailant;
a two-second burst was supposed to cause muscle spasms and a major loss of bodily control;
a three-second burst would purportedly make your assailant flop on the ground like a fish out of water.
Any burst longer than three seconds would be wasting the batteries.
...Reasoning that a one-second burst from such a tiny little ole thing couldn't hurt all that bad....He decided to give his'self a one-second burst just for the heck of it.
He touched the prongs to his naked thigh, pushed the button, and ... HOLY MOTHER ..WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION...@!@$$!%!@*!!!

He was pretty sure Jessie Ventura ran in through the side door, picked him up in the recliner, then body slammed him on the carpet, over and over and over again.
He vaguely recalled waking up on his side in the fetal position, with tears in his eyes, body soaking wet, both nipples on fire, testicles nowhere to be found, his left arm tucked under his body in the oddest position, and tingling in his legs.
The cat was standing over him making meowing sounds he had never heard before, licking his face, undoubtedly thinking to herself, "Do it again, do it again!"

[Gunlovingvet]

Just for giggles:


Now thats funny:eek:

[JeffinTD]

Tasers are optional for me, but I've found them to be a very handy tool. There is always a tendency, though, for someone who just got trained on a fancy new hammer to see every problem as a nail. You just need to drive home that this is only one of many tools. You still need to make the correct decision on which one to use, and you always need a plan B.

Anyway, going hands on has it's disadvantages. Wrestling on pavement, or up against a chain link fence, both you and the resisting person tend to get skinned up.

Getting tested for HIV, hep C and that kind of stuff from a work related exposure is not fun...

Also, the times I've had to use one or seen a taser used, it was often in a situation where a night stick or other serious force would have had to been used.

IMHO a police department has a responsibility to use tools and/or methods that reduce the risk of injuries to both officers and offenders, and in my experience tasers (with proper training) fall in that catagory.

[XLR8R]

I completely agree with everything you said, but in a perfect world (i.e. a litigation-free society:rolleyes: ), what's wrong with meting out force to offenders - even if it's accidentally (or incidentally) excessive?

I mean, if get bumped, bruised and rashed for scuffling with a LEO, shouldn't that be an important part of the deterrent value of criminally-induced punitive consequences?

It ought to lower anyone's rate of recidivism... :)

[Pull Ya]

We used to call that "street justice" in the 60's. It resulted in a lot of what I considered at the time "bad" court decisions. Some officers failed to use what I consider plain common sense--in some cases(ie; knowing when to stop). Thats where the problem started. No more basement confessions or using long hair and a VW bus as PC for a search(which never happened). One comment about spraying someone---why does one officer always have to give the suspect one last shot--just as he is being stuffed into the back of my patrol car--usually early in the shift--then I have to drive around in that car the rest of the night:mad: :mad:
Jay

[JeffinTD]

The first time I saw a Taser used, it was on a guy high on meth who was way out of control and took a swing at an officer. From what I saw it may have taken batons to get the guy in custody and likely both the subject and officers would have been injured. Instead the subject ended up with two little pin prick marks in his back, for which a band aid would have been overkill.

Tasers aren't perfect, but there are times when proper use prevents risk of serious injury to officers, and the subject.

I see the original poster's point, in that there is a danger of having people just issued a fancy new hammer to view every problem as a nail, but that is an issue that must be addressed in training.

Also, in this day and age, the point about going hands-on near a chain link fence or on pavement and ending up with a bodily fluid exposure is very valid.

In the end the Taser is just another tool. With training and good judgement it can be valuable. Officers also need to be trained to be prepared with a plan B if it doesn't work, just as they are if some other tool or control hold doesn't work.